Saincheisteanna Tráthúla - Topical Issue Debate – Dáil Éireann (34th Dáil) – Thursday, 26 Jun 2025

Saincheisteanna Tráthúla - Topical Issue Debate

Road Projects

Deputy Michael Cahill

The town of Killarney is choked with traffic almost daily. This is causing mass frustration for residents, local businesses and visitors alike. Members of the public are missing trains and buses, along with GP, dental and hospital appointments, and many others, because of the gridlock. Killarney in County Kerry is the capital of tourism in Ireland and is the main reason for visiting this country for many foreign travellers. Killarney has been catering for tourists since Victorian times and is renowned for its professionalism in the sector due to its long years of experience. This success that Killarney has at attracting visitors to the town has brought about a chronic traffic gridlock problem that must now be dealt with via a planned new road or bypass from Lissivigeen just outside Killarney and onwards to Farranfore. It is of the utmost importance that the Government continues to support the Killarney to Farranfore project financially, planning-wise, etc. A sum of €3 million has already been allocated this year by my colleague, the Minister for Transport, Deputy Darragh O'Brien.

Local residents in Killarney regularly miss trains and buses and doctor and dentist appointments. It could take six or seven minutes to walk from St. Mary's Cathedral in Killarney to the railway station, but 35 minutes or 40 minutes in traffic. Taxi drivers have told me that to get around the town is a nightmare daily. Delivering goods to retail outlets is also a nightmare. I have experience of spending well over an hour getting from Lissivigeen to Fossa, a distance of just a few miles. This is a priority for the Killarney Chamber of Tourism and Commerce and for all of us, including Kerry County Council. Killarney is a tourism flagship and attracts visitors in their hundreds of thousands, bringing much-needed foreign currency to these shores. The Government must support our tourism industry by forging ahead with the bypass from Killarney to Farranfore, or the Kerry-to-Cork economic corridor as the Taoiseach called it. Transport Infrastructure Ireland, TII, must provide the funding at the earlier possible date. As Fianna Fáil's spokesperson on tourism, this is also a priority for me. I have raised this issue on several occasions in this House and I am pleading for this important infrastructure to be expedited.

Minister of State at the Department of Transport (Deputy Seán Canney)

I thank Deputy Cahill for raising this matter. The new programme for Government acknowledges "that good connectivity within the country ... is essential to foster continued economic growth, for communities, and our tourism industry". We have committed to investing in all road projects in the current national development plan, NDP, and to work on improving infrastructure to key tourism spots, making travel more convenient for visitors.

The Minister for Transport has responsibility for overall policy and Exchequer funding in relation to the national roads programme. Once funding arrangements have been put in place with TII, under the Roads Acts 1993-2015, and in line with the national development plan, the operation and management of individual national roads is a matter for TII in conjunction with the local authorities concerned. TII ultimately delivers the national roads programme in line with Project Ireland 2040, the national planning framework and the NDP. The Government has earmarked €5.1 billion for capital spending on new national roads projects from 2021 to 2030 as part of the NDP. This funding will enable improved regional accessibility across the country as well as compact growth, which are key national strategic outcomes. The funding will provide for the development of numerous national road projects, including the completion of projects already at construction stage and those close to it, as well as the development of several others. As the greater portion of this funding becomes available in the second half of the decade, this means there was a constraint on the funding available for new projects in 2025. However, approximately €502 million of Exchequer capital funds were provided for national roads through TII to local authorities in 2025. This includes approximately €1 million in funding for the development of the N22 Killarney to Farranfore project.

This project is currently at the route options selection stage. Kerry County Council presented the preferred transport solution for the N22 Farranfore to Killarney scheme to the general public as part of public consultation No. 2 held on 11 and 12 November 2024. The consultation period ran for four weeks and concluded on 6 December 2024. The options selection phase is complete, design works are ongoing and ground investigation works are expected to commence shortly.

The N22 Killarney to Farranfore project would deliver improvements to approximately 27 km of the N22, as well as a bypass of the village of Farranfore and an outer bypass of Killarney. It is important to point out the project remains part of the national development plan, and sufficient funding has enabled the route options phase of the project to be concluded with a preferred route selected. As with all national roads projects in the NDP, the delivery programme for the N22 Killarney to Farranfore project will be kept under review for 2025 and in future years and it will be considered in terms of the overall funding envelope available to TII.

Deputy Michael Cahill

Killarney is the best town in Ireland for a town of its size. It is also the best town in Europe for a town of its size.

Everyone goes to Killarney. I cannot emphasise strongly enough how important this project is. It is in the making for quite a number of years but it has come to the point where action is required right now. It should be at the very top of the political priority list. It should be at the very top of Transport Infrastructure Ireland's priority list. I am again pleading for the funding to be made available and to expedite this hugely important piece of infrastructure.

It is Kerry County Council's top priority also. I mentioned the Chamber of Tourism and Commerce in Killarney. This is hugely important to the chamber. Its members see on a daily basis the effects of the chronic traffic jams and delays, etc. One cannot get around the town. I am repeating myself by calling it a nightmare because that is exactly what it is.

I plead with the Minister of State to take it up with Transport Infrastructure Ireland to make a case to the Minister, Deputy Darragh O'Brien. I have already mentioned it to Deputy O'Brien on a number of occasions and, obviously, the Minister for Finance and the Minister for public expenditure. I will be hammering this issue again in here until such time as it is delivered.

Deputy Seán Canney

I have been to Killarney as well, like most people in Ireland, on a number of occasions and had good memories coming away from it.

The N22 project is included in the NDP, and has received a significant funding allocation for 2025. As I said, approximately €502 million of Exchequer capital funds was provided to TII for national roads this year. In line with the NDP and Government policy, TII sought to allocate national road funding to local authorities in a manner which seeks to achieve the following key outcomes: protection and renewal of the existing national road network; progressing major projects in or near construction; and progressing major projects which are pre-construction but well advanced in the development pipeline.

A number of new roads projects which are included in the current national development plan have already been delivered. The national development plan is the vehicle by which projects are delivered. This includes the N22 Ballyvourney-to-Macroom project, the Dunkettle interchange upgrade, the N5 Westport-to-Turlough road project, and bypasses of Moycullen and Listowel. The programme for Government commits to increased funding for new roads as part of the national development plan review and to the maintenance of existing roads. I met with TII today to discuss funding and projects into the future.

This project has commenced and I do not believe we would be spending money on a project if we were not going to deliver it. I hope that it will get through all of the processes it needs to get through in order for it to be delivered. I will be talking again to the Minister, Deputy O'Brien, about it. He is fully aware of the importance of this project for Killarney.

An Ceann Comhairle

I say "Hello" to Deputy Sherlock up in the Gallery with a contingent. The Deputy has her hands full.

Departmental Funding

Deputy Denise Mitchell

St. Luke's Youth Club and community centre in Kilmore West has been closed since 2023. The centre was used by many groups within the community, from football clubs to ladies groups and summer projects. In 2023, I contacted Dublin City Council, DCC, regarding the closure of the building. I received an email - I have it here for the Minister of State - informing me that a report into the works that were needed would be completed by the first week in January 2024. Rolling on, it is June 2025 and still no works have been completed there.

Expressions of interest were opened for groups who would like to use the premises. Two local groups came forward and expressed interest. It seemed like we were having movement on it and then, all of a sudden, it stalled again. We were told that the council was going to meet the groups but nothing happened. We have received no timeframe for when this work will be completed and in the meantime, we have young girls changing on the side of the road for football matches. Local summer projects had to find new premises. The Minister of State will agree that is simply not good enough.

Kilmore West has amazing volunteers who want to better their community. They give up their own hours - many hours - for the children in Kilmore West. This area is badly in need of amenities. We have seen our local swimming pool closed. We have seen Kilmore Celtic fighting for years for amenities. I want to give the Minister of State an indication of the situation. When I was on Dublin City Council in 2014, one of the main campaigns from the local councillors was for a playground. Fast forward 11 years, we only got our playground now. We cannot sit around for another 11 years waiting for this to be completed. What can the Minister of State do to make sure this is done as a matter of urgency?

Deputy Dessie Ellis

St. Luke's community centre was built decades ago. At the time, the community of Kilmore and surrounding areas fought tooth and nail to get this badly needed facility. For the best part of a year and a half, it has been closed by Dublin City Council. With little or no consultation with the community, the building was blocked up and closed and access refused. The building itself is in good condition except for a number of works to be carried out, which would cost in the region of €150,000.

There is no shortage of people looking to use this building. There is a huge increase in the population locally, with hundreds of new apartments and houses built and being built. Kilmore Celtic, a local football club across the road, has young girls and boys with no place to change, go to the toilet or even have a shower. It is a huge embarrassment and a terrible indictment that visiting football teams, especially young girls, have to change out in the open and cannot even go to the toilet or have a shower.

At a time when young children are going on holidays, summer projects and activities should be taking place in this community building. Senior citizens and community groups are crying out for facilities. People and those with disabilities have nowhere to go while attending football matches across the road from the centre - so much for disability-proofing our communities.

I have engaged with Dublin City Council personnel on a good number of occasions. I have repeatedly been told that we are moving ahead but there is still no movement. It is frustrating that excuse after excuse has been put in the way.

This is a vital community facility which we urgently need. There seems to be an unwillingness to move ahead with this project and that is part of the problem.

Deputy Seán Canney

First of all, I am shocked to hear that girls and boys have to change their clothes out in the open. It is fairly archaic and dangerous.

The Government recognises the important role that community centres play in community life in Ireland, particularly in bringing people together and engaging with those who may be marginalised or disadvantaged. Over the past four years, the Department of Rural and Community Development and the Gaeltacht has prioritised the development and enhancement of community centres across the country through a new dedicated funding stream for community centres.

The community centre investment fund, CCIF, was introduced to respond to the funding needs of community centres, in both rural and urban areas, so that we can support the provision of high-quality, accessible, community spaces. The CCIF has provided more than €109 million since 2022 for the enhancement and refurbishment of existing community centres and the construction of new centres. Under the first fund launched in 2022, over €45 million was committed for improvement and refurbishment works on over 860 existing community centres across Ireland. This includes 78 projects in County Dublin with funding of over €4.6 million. I have been informed by the Minister, Deputy Calleary, that the majority of these projects are now complete and benefiting communities all over Ireland.

The latest iteration of the CCIF, in 2024, also supported the enhancement and refurbishment of community centres. Through that round of funding, over €33 million has been approved for more than 770 projects nationwide. This includes funding of up to €100,000 each for category 2 projects that my colleague, the Minister, Deputy Calleary, announced for 369 community centres last March. Again, there were over 60 successful projects in County Dublin, with funding of €2.6 million approved.

The scheme has also supported community groups that are striving to build their own community centres. The 2023 CCIF was opened specifically for applications for new community centres. The 2023 new-build scheme supported communities with shovel-ready projects on greenfield or brownfield sites for the construction of new community centres. A capital grant of between €1 million and €6 million was available to build multi-functional centres in areas that lacked community facilities. Through that iteration of the fund, the Department of the Minister, Deputy Calleary, approved funding of €30 million for the construction of 12 new community centres in nine counties.

Regarding community facilities in Kilmore, I understand that local authority officials are exploring potential arrangements in existing facilities to support the community there. This approach would allow support for community activity in the short term while preserving resources for a more sustainable and integrated solution in the future.

While the Government’s immediate priority is to facilitate the delivery of the 770 projects that have recently been announced, we are also committed to delivering further iterations of the scheme in the coming years. This is in line with the commitment in the programme for Government for this to become a permanent rolling fund. Over the coming months, further consideration will be given to what the next round of the CCIF will involve and the types of facilities that will be targeted. I am confident that the fund will continue to play a central role in supporting strong and resilient communities.

Deputy Denise Mitchell

With respect, Kilmore only got four lines in the reply. That is not on the Minister of State - he was given that to read. This was a specific question about a specific area where we feel we are going around in circles. We have been engaging with Dublin City Council and officials. We are asking for support from the Minister of State’s Department to get this over the line.

Councillors on the north central area committee were recently told that the issue would be looked at. What we are asking for is commitment. I thank the Minister of State for the reply but it did not have very much for the people of Kilmore. I ask the Department to please engage with Dublin City Council to finally get this sorted once and for all for the community of Kilmore West.

Deputy Dessie Ellis

It seems there was no application whatsoever made on behalf of the Kilmore community centre, which is so disappointing. No attempt was made to get funding. However, there is funding in Dublin City Council, as well as from the Oscar Traynor development which has a €7 million fund which could be used to the tune of €150,000 in this case. It seems as though Kilmore has not been given a second thought. It is my opinion that there has been resistance from the management in Dublin City Council about this. It is unacceptable for any community centre to be closed down for a year and a half. This is a community centre that was hard fought for and is badly needed in a community that is crying out for services. It is an absolute shame.

Deputy Seán Canney

I know Deputy Mitchell said I had two or three lines in relation to Kilmore. Deputy Ellis has hit the nail on the head. If an application comes in to a Department, it will be dealt with. Deputy Heneghan, who is present, has spoken to me about this before. The Department cannot provide funding until an application comes in. Two application processes have been gone through and there will be further application processes. My advice, and I come from a community background myself, is to get back to the local authority and tell it to get ready for the next call. That advice is not in the reply. I am giving it to the Deputies myself. That is the way I would do it. I was telling the Deputies all the money that has been given out by the Department for the two iterations of the scheme. There was also a scheme for new community centres. Dublin community centres benefited from that, as did hundreds of community centres right across the country. This is not the forum in which this should be tackled. The Department has provided funding. My experience from making applications with my own community is that if you make the application, it will be dealt with fairly.

I would go back to the Deputy’s initial point about girls and boys togging out to play football or whatever else out in the open. I used to do it when I was a young lad, which is not today nor yesterday, in the turlough in Belclare but nobody could see us doing it. I would tell the Deputies to go back and see where the local authority is at with it. That is where it needs to be interrogated first. I appreciate that the Deputies have raised it and that Deputy Heneghan has also raised it with me and others in the group too. Working together, hopefully we will get it over the line.

Public Transport

Deputy Brendan Smith

I appreciate the Ceann Comhairle giving me the opportunity to raise this important issue. I also appreciate that the Minister of State at the Department of Transport, Deputy Canney, is here to reply.

Bus commuters on the Cavan-Dublin route were absolutely shocked to learn on 16 June of a massive increase in fares from that date. A daily return ticket from Cavan to Dublin was increased from €18.50 to €27.30, an increase of almost 50%. I was not aware of the proposed increase and I know from regular commuters on that route who contacted me that they were also unaware.

Over recent years there has been a welcome increase in the frequency of bus services in both rural and urban areas which we all welcome. The policy of successive Governments has been to encourage people to use public transport where possible. That policy has been supported practically unanimously by the Oireachtas. To encourage people to switch to public transport there is a need for reasonably priced fares. The decision by the National Transport Authority in the case of the route I am discussing is not fair and it is not equitable. Those fares must be reviewed and reduced. Typically on a bus any morning there are people going to work, students going to college, people going to hospital appointments and people going about their ordinary business. As the Minister of State will be aware there is a commitment in the programme for Government to keep fares low and affordable. I think the people on that particular route would question how that policy is being implemented.

A young lady who travelled on the route five days a week contacted me and sent me an extract from the relevant website. The question posed on the website was, “What this means for commuters” and the answer was, “From June 16th, fares on commuter services provided by both Bus Éireann and Go-Ahead Ireland are to change with some decreasing, some increasing, and some largely unchanged.” There was no mention of Cavan fares and the massive increase proposed there. That young lady did some research and said it appears to be by far the highest fare increase in recent times.

I am asking the Minister of State to ask the National Transport Authority to review that determination as urgently as possible and to have the fare substantially reduced to the range of what it was until 16 June. As he will know, the three counties of Ulster in this State, namely, Donegal, Monaghan and Cavan, do not have a rail service. When we travel from Cavan to Dublin we pay two tolls on the way to the outskirts of Dublin city. There is a lot of congestion in the outer Dublin area and in the city. People want to use public transport but they want to have it at a reasonable price.

I sincerely request that the National Transport Authority be told to review this matter, reduce the fares and ensure that commuters from Cavan to Dublin and Dublin to Cavan are treated with respect and provided with a reasonable fare structure.

Deputy Seán Canney

The Deputy has spoken to me before about this issue. I really appreciate his bringing it to light.

From the outset, I would like to clarify that the Minister for Transport has responsibility for policy and overall funding in relation to public transport. However, neither the Minister nor his officials are involved in the day-to-day operation of public transport services. The statutory responsibility for securing the provision of public passenger transport services nationally rests with the National Transport Authority. The NTA works with the public transport operators, which deliver the services and have responsibility for day-to-day operational matters.

The NTA also has statutory responsibility for the regulation of fares charged to passengers in respect of public transport services provided under public service obligation, PSO, contracts.

In this context, the NTA published the national fares strategy in 2023. This aims to create a more equitable, consistent and easy-to-understand fare system based on distance travelled. In line with this strategy, the NTA published fare determinations in January 2024 covering the Dublin city zone, 25 km from the city centre, and the Dublin commuter zone, 50 km from the city centre. This determination is being implemented in two phases. The second phase of this determination was introduced on 28 April 2025 with new multimodal fare caps and revised commuter rail fares.

Phase 2b, pertaining to adjustments to commuter bus fares, commenced on 16 June 2025. I understand these are the fares to which the Deputy referred. This builds on the previous rail fare changes introduced in April. The new zones and fare structures, which have been widely publicised, aim to deliver more consistent and equitable fares and reduce disparities, particularly in the outer commuter towns surrounding Dublin. These are distance-based fares.

The existing fare structures were not always equitable, consistent or easy for passengers to understand, and the new distance-based approach aims to address this by providing a fairer and clearer fare system. In Cavan, fares have seen an increase in the single adult category from €9.45 to €11.40. It is important to note that these fare changes will see increases for some passengers and decreases for others in order to allow for a more equitable fares structure, and it is the NTA’s intention to roll out further changes in future determinations during 2025.

Deputy Brendan Smith

I thank the Minister of State for the reply. The figure I have been given, and the fare I know people are paying, is the return fare, which increased from €18.50 to €27.30. That is a somewhat different percentage increase than that for the single fare he cited. He quite correctly said the intention is to have a fair charging system. That is not applicable in the case of the Cavan route I referenced in my introductory remarks.

One issue I have been raising since before the Minister of State was appointed, during the term of office of the former Minister, Eamon Ryan, was the need to introduce a direct Cavan to Dublin service, leaving Cavan in the morning at peak times, 5 a.m. or 6 a.m., stopping in only Virginia and Whitegate on the Cavan-Meath border and then going directly to Busáras. At the moment, most services go through Kells and other Meath towns, which means it takes those wishing to travel from Cavan to Dublin longer.

In the evening time, when people are returning to Cavan, if they leave at around 3 o'clock in the afternoon, when the bus for Cavan reaches Blanchardstown or Phibsborough, it is sometimes full. Many passengers on the bus are passengers going to Meath towns, where there is a welcome frequency of buses to Navan and Kells. Local employees in Bus Éireann are as anxious as commuters and I are to see direct routes leaving Busáras at peak evening times, between 3.30 p.m and 5.30 p.m., that would stop only at Whitegate on the Cavan-Meath border, Virginia and Cavan town.

As I said, early morning buses from Cavan should leave Cavan, stop at Virginia and Whitegate and then travel directly to Busáras. That would considerably enhance the standard of service for commuters and people travelling every day. I know it is very difficult for Bus Éireann employees to see patients leaving James Connolly Hospital in Blanchardstown having to wait hours to get on a bus. That is not acceptable. I hope the Minister of State can raise the issue with the Minister.

Deputy Seán Canney

I assure the Deputy the Government is strongly committed to providing all citizens with reliable and realistic sustainable mobility options and public transport plays a key role in the delivery of this goal. To support this objective, in budget 2025 the Department of Transport secured €658 million in funding, an increase from €613 million for 2024.

This funding supports the continuation of the 20% fare reduction in PSO services, the young adult card for PSO and commercial bus services and the 90-minute rail fare until the end of 2025. The Deputy referenced a return fare increase from €18.50 to €27.30. I will check that. It seems like a large increase.

I will examine peak-time morning and evening schedules. People travel from Dublin and board at different stops, and services have to let people off. It is about the experience we want to give passengers if we hope to get more and more people to use public transport. I will, however, bring these matters back to the Minister.

The Department's investment of €658 million in the PSO and Local Link services in 2025 demonstrates our commitment to a sustainable, equitable and accessible public transport network for all. It is also a sign of the times that we are now very exercised about public transport quality because more and more people are demanding it. That is a success in itself. We need to make sure people get a good experience every time.

I again thank the Deputy. I will speak to the Minister, Deputy O'Brien, about the issues he has raised.

Crime Prevention

Deputy Gary Gannon

In six years of having been here and having been a regular contributor to Topical Issue debates, this is the first time I have had a senior Minister here to respond. While I will often disagree with the Minister and we will often clash, I do not doubt for a second his dedication to the issues he is in charge of.

There has unquestionably been an increase in the Garda presence in the commercial city centre of Dublin over the past six months. The Minister and his Department should be commended on that. Many retailers can see the benefits of the increased Garda presence. One consequence of that is the displacement of some of the issues in the commercial city centre, which have now been pushed into the more residential parts of the inner city. We have seen an increase in open drug dealing, the intimidation that goes alongside that and antisocial behaviour. For 30 or 40 years we have heard about the containment of problems. Tony Gregory, long before I was ever in the House, used that phrase to describe parts of the city where there were issues that were tolerated in a way they would not otherwise be.

I will highlight some of the emails sent to me and issues raised with me this week. Today, I received an email from a resident in the Russell Street area, alongside Croke Park. It is 150 m from Fitzgibbon Street Garda station. The person concerned referred to an increase in burglaries in the area. The Russell Street Bakery, a lovely bakery that has been frequented by new people living in the community, was burgled this week. The understanding is that although there is a Garda station beside the bakery, it is rarely policed or manned, and people who are up to no good have cottoned on to that fact.

The Minister might not know North Frederick Street Court, an apartment complex behind the Gate Theatre and Chapter One Restaurant. Those businesses have said they are overwhelmed by the displacement of people who have been pushed out of the commercial city centre and into laneways. People should always be tolerated, but there is open drug dealing, and the violence associated with that, in North Frederick Street Court.

Mountjoy Square, which for me could become the jewel in the crown of the north side, is experiencing a significant level of violence and gang-related crime. Council workers have spoken about being fearful of going into Mountjoy Square because they regularly find knives stashed in the shrubbery. Open drug dealing also seems to be happening along the canal and people are fearful of walking in the area at night due to the use of electric scooters to transport drugs. The area is seen as an artery for transporting drugs.

I regularly speak about the north inner city. I love the area and it is part of who I am. The issues the area is experiencing are generational and a product of the location in which the community is placed.

The improved policing in the commercial city centre is really welcome, but some of the displacement factors stemming from this seem to mean that some of the issues that were there are now being tolerated in more residential parts. Is this the Minister's shared understanding? Perhaps we can speak afterwards about what we might do about it.

Minister for Justice, Home Affairs and Migration (Deputy Jim O'Callaghan)

I thank Deputy Gannon for raising this issue. When there is a Topical Issue that is relevant to my Department, I will hope to be here. If I am available and not off elsewhere out of Dublin, I will be here for them. I thank Deputy Gannon for raising these issues, which are also of concern to me, not only as Minister for justice but as a TD for Dublin Bay South, which is just over the Liffey from the area he represents.

Deputy Gannon is correct; there is increased Garda visibility in the city centre. As he did, I commend the Garda on it. It has been a good development. I encouraged it and I am glad it appears to be getting public recognition. Much of the time people really want to see gardaí on the streets. It gives them a sense of safety and security. As we have said previously, it is a good reflection on the police force in the country that people want to see them around as much as possible.

To give Deputy Gannon some of the statistics, as of April 2025 there were 3,824 gardaí working in Dublin. Of these, 1,413 were assigned to Dublin metropolitan north central and south central. Effectively, the inner city has 1,413 gardaí. The reason for the increased visibility of gardaí in the city at present is not so much that gardaí are being moved out of other residential areas into the city centre. To a large extent, it is a policy decision made by the Commissioner. Great credit goes to the assistant commissioner Paul Cleary because recently 101 gardaí from Templemore were assigned to the city centre north-central and south-central regions. This has had an impact on policing.

I do not believe it is the case, although I will check with the Commissioner, that what has happened is that gardaí have been moved from outer parts of the city to inner parts. I do not think this has happened. In fairness, what Deputy Gannon appears to be saying is that some of the problems and criminality that were ongoing in the inner city have moved out a bit because of the increased policing in the inner city.

Deputy Gannon mentioned a number of areas. I am concerned to hear about the burglary of the bakery in Russell Street. I am aware of Russell Street, an historic street where Brendan Behan was born. The fact there is a Garda station beside a business does not mean it is immune to burglary or criminal attack. In many respects, I want to see gardaí out of Garda stations and on the streets. Certainly any increase in burglary is an issue of concern because it can spiral. Sometimes when the gardaí apprehend people, the number of burglaries reduces because one or two individuals can have a significant impact on burglaries in an area.

Deputy Gannon mentioned Frederick Court in North Frederick Street and drug dealing going on in the laneways there. That certainly used to happen in my constituency, beside Deputy Gannon's constituency, in the laneways off Aston Quay. I hope that the Garda will get up to the laneways off North Frederick Street and I will bring it to its attention.

Earlier today I was down at the Merchants Quay centre. I know Deputy Gannon will be interested to hear this. The project there does excellent work. Every time I get involved with people who have drug addiction, I see the sadness of drug addiction and the terrible impact it has on people's lives. Merchants Quay is doing very good projects. For the past six months, there has been the injection facility downstairs and it is working well. I know it can give rise to contentious views. Looking at it from the point of view of the city, however, it is having an impact in reducing the number of people who have to take drugs in a public setting. They can now do it in a private setting.

Deputy Gary Gannon

I think the Minister misunderstood what I was implying when I spoke about the increased presence of gardaí in the city centre. I was not suggesting for a second that gardaí were being taken from various Garda stations and being brought into the city centre. What I was suggesting was that perhaps there is a policy of containment of problems in residential areas such that they are not coming into commercial areas. That is the feedback I get from residents.

There was an initiative in the north inner city ten or 12 years ago called the small area policing initiative. Gardaí had the responsibility to knock on people's doors and introduce themselves. They were tasked with knocking on every door in the area to introduce themselves and explain that they were the local gardaí. It worked phenomenally well. It created a presence whereby people knew their gardaí and got the sense that the gardaí were there for them. In the decades since, that has been stripped away for a variety of reasons, which I do not want to get into now. When we lost that, we lost our sense of gardaí in the community, tackling issues and building relationships there. We do not have this any more. The prioritisation seems to be angled towards what I refer to as the commercial city centre. I understand why this is. Two years ago, I was here speaking about the issues in that area. We need to get both right at the same time.

Even though we are saying there has been an increased Garda presence in the city centre, I do not know whether the Minister has ever walked along O'Connell Street or gone over O'Connell Bridge at 9 p.m. or 10 p.m.

Deputy Jim O'Callaghan

I have.

Deputy Gary Gannon

It is not something that could be described as safe, even with the increased Garda presence. Next week after the voting block, I will walk across with the Minister. I walk through there every night.

Deputy Jim O'Callaghan

I was there last Thursday.

Deputy Gary Gannon

We can have a look. It is clearly not meeting the standard required, although there have clearly been improvements. I believe we need a different form of policing in commercial areas from that in residential areas. It requires a different strategy and a different approach, not quite a municipal police force but something similar. Residential policing and the policing of more commercial areas are different. We need community gardaí in our communities knocking on doors and introducing themselves, and we need gardaí on the streets and in commercial areas to have a different role.

Deputy Jim O'Callaghan

The gardaí in the inner city are not just there for the commercial sector. In my constituency , and I am sure Deputy Gannon's is the same, there are many residential areas in the inner city. In my constituency there is Glovers Court, which is right beside Aungier Street, as well as York Street and Mercer House. People want to see gardaí in the area. One of the good things about Dublin, unlike capital cities like London, is that we still have communities living in the city centre. It is good that Dublin City Council still has large units for accommodation in the city centre. The fact there are more gardaí in the city centre is not directed at trying to make the city centre a place for the commercial sector. It is trying to make it safe for everyone, including people who come to visit, people who work there and, very importantly, people who live there.

On the point the Deputy made about relationships with the gardaí, a good community garda is like a good politician, in that people in the area know them. This is something I want to see continue. It does happen in areas, although perhaps it is more difficult in cities the size of Dublin, but it is very important that we have community gardaí in the city centre. I hear what Deputy Gannon said about the small area policing initiative. It sounds like a very good thing. I assure him that in certain parts of the city, gardaí are known to the local communities.

Much of this issue comes back to the fact that we need more gardaí. If we have more gardaí, there is much more we will be able to achieve. I am trying to recruit, and we have the funding to recruit 1,000 gardaí each year. I will not give up on that. It really is a requirement. If we have more gardaí available, we will have more gardaí on the streets of Dublin and in other cities. I am conscious that when people hear about increased policing in Dublin, they ask about Wexford, Galway or Cork.

Deputy Gary Gannon

They can raise their own Topical Issues.

Deputy Jim O'Callaghan

We need to ensure there are as many gardaí as possible so they are around the country and on the streets.

School Staff

An Ceann Comhairle

This Topical Issue is shared by Deputies Ó Muirí and Heneghan.

Deputy Naoise Ó Muirí

This issue comes down to teacher allocation numbers. It is a matter of great concern to parents that Belgrove infant girls' school, which had an intake of 216 in the 2023-24 school year and qualified for nine teachers, is now down to eight teachers based on the 2024-25 intake. The projected number for September is 219, which is above the number at which it qualified for nine teachers previously. This looks like a temporary aberration and the key is to look at a temporary resource allocation so the school can get over this little hump. There is a similar issue in Howth primary school, in the constituency I share with Deputy Heneghan. A class there will go from a pupil-teacher ratio of 18:1 to 35:1 on account of the loss of a teacher, which is also of great concern to parents.

I will share the rest of my time with Deputy Heneghan.

Deputy Barry Heneghan

I will reiterate what Deputy Ó Muirí said. Belgrove infant girls' school, located beside the school I went to as a young boy, is being forced to merge two classes together. Hundreds of parents and children who are really stressed by this have approached me as I walk the streets of my local community . I do not understand how the fact that the school's current enrolment numbers for next year are above the threshold but the Department cannot give a temporary solution to this. The school will exceed the numbers. I understand that the rules are set that it has to be on 30 September, but can a temporary solution be given to this school?

I also reiterate what Deputy Ó Muirí said about the Howth primary school, Scoil Mhuire. The two second classes are being merged into a single class of 35 students. This is not a choice; it is the result of the regulation I just mentioned. The Department of education is only looking at the overall numbers within the school, but this can translate into having huge classes or splitting the class levels, which is not ideal for the learning of our up-and-coming generation. I urge the Minister of State and every Member to put as much pressure on this to get a solution. The parents would be really appreciative. The Minister of State would be too if his child were being forced into a school classroom that would affect his or her learning. I hope we can get a solution to this. I thank Deputy Ó Muirí and all the Deputies who have worked hard to try to get a solution to this.

Deputy Seán Canney

I thank Deputies Ó Muirí and Heneghan for raising this important issue regarding the staffing of primary schools, particularly the teacher allocation to Belgrove infant girls' school and Scoil Mhuire in Howth.

The key factor for determining the level of staffing resources provided at individual school level is the staffing schedule for the relevant school year and pupil enrolments on the previous 30 September. The primary staffing arrangements for the 2025-26 school year are set out in Circular 11/25. The staffing schedule operates in a clear and transparent manner and treats all similar types of schools equally, irrespective of location. It is an important feature of the staffing schedule that all schools are treated equally and fairly.

Under the programme for Government, there is a commitment to aim to reduce the general pupil-teacher ratio at primary level to 19:1 over the term of the Government and introduce targeted measures in schools with very large classes. This will build on the progress made by previous Governments. The general average of pupils to teachers in the primary staffing schedule improved from 26:1 five years ago to 23:1 for the current school year, the lowest ever ratio at primary level. Teacher allocations for DEIS urban band 1 schools have also been improved and now stand at averages of 17:1, 21:1 and 19:1 for junior, senior and vertical schools, respectively. In addition, there has been a three-point reduction in the retention schedule, which has helped schools that would otherwise be at risk of losing teaching posts. Average class sizes in primary schools have improved from 24.1 to 22.5 in that time, while the ratio of pupils to teachers has improved from 15:1 to 12.8:1 with the investment we are making in schools.

The two schools referred to by the Deputies, Belgrove and the school in Howth, are to have a reduction in teaching posts for the 2025-26 school year due to a fall in enrolments. The staffing arrangements include an appeals mechanism for schools to submit a staffing appeal under certain published criteria. The staffing appeals criteria, which are set out in Circular 11/25, include specific appeals for small schools, enrolments in the previous October, projected enrolments, accommodation difficulties, infant class sizes and language support. Belgrove infants girls' school submitted a staffing appeal to the March meeting of the primary staffing appeals board under the projected enrolments criteria. Having considered the staffing appeal from the girls’ school, the primary staffing appeals board determined that the grounds of the appeal did not meet the requirements set out in the circular. The primary staffing appeals board operates independently of the Department and its decision is final.

Class sizes in schools are affected by a variety of factors, including enrolment fluctuations and the accommodation available. Schools are best placed to determine the appropriate numbers in any class. The configuration of classes and the deployment of classroom teachers are therefore done at local school level. The Department's guidance to schools is that the number of pupils in any class should be kept as low as possible, taking all relevant contextual factors into account. School authorities should also, where possible, use their autonomy under the staffing schedule to implement smaller class sizes for junior cycles.

Deputy Naoise Ó Muirí

I thank the Minister of State for his response. I appreciate his acknowledgement that Belgrove has been through an appeals process. I understand it is an independent process. I welcome the statistics on the improvement of class sizes in primary schools. In this instance, however, Belgrove will go backwards for a period because of this aberration in teacher numbers. I think it is a unique case because the school's numbers are clearly going up again this year. They are actually already up but, with the way the system works, the calculation is behind. I encourage the Department to see whether we can find some temporary solution, such as some sort of allocation. The school stands ready to help. As Deputy Heneghan said, the parents are willing, ready and able to help to see whether we can find a solution to this. I appreciate that Scoil Mhuire, the Howth national school, was not raised at the time of the submission of the Topical Issue, but it is probably in a similar situation. Hopefully we can find a solution.

Deputy Barry Heneghan

I reiterate what Deputy Ó Muirí said. We need to get a temporary solution for this. There was clearly an error with the appeals. Is there any way to find an alternative solution for these parents and the children who will be put into a class size such as this? It will affect their learning and their experience. These are young girls who are already under enough stress. There has to be something here. Can an exemption be made for the school? Can a different funding source be used to keep this teacher on board? Both schools are under real stress. All the parents would like some update from the Department. I understand the Minister of State's reference to the programme for Government and the ratio we are looking at, but this school will go backwards on that. It will not reach that ratio or anywhere near it, and the kids' learning will be affected by this.

Deputy Seán Canney

The Minister for Education and Youth is considering how best to make further progress as part of the annual budgetary process in reducing the primary pupil-teacher ratio in the context of the programme for Government. With regard to the appeal for Belgrove, the primary staffing appeals board operates independently of the Department and its decision is final. I do not know if there is an appeals process to that independent board, because it meets some of the criteria, such as projected school numbers for next year. I do not know if there is a mechanism to go back there.

I will ask the Department to correspond with both Deputies in that regard to see if there is a mechanism within the independent process to appeal the appeal. It is hard on the parents, the children and the board of management to try to work through this. It deflates the buzz that should be in schools when they lose a teacher and staff member. I thank both Deputies for bringing up this important issue and will see whether an appeal of the appeal can be made.

Dáil Éireann debate - Thursday, 26 Jun 2025