Vol. 1089 No. 1
87. Deputy Paul Murphy asked the Minister for Further and Higher Education, Research, Innovation and Science the reforms he plans on implementing to increase take-up of craft apprenticeships; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [50241/26]
The number one reform that would make the most difference is ensuring that apprentices at least get the national minimum wage from the start. That is not a radical demand. I was previously on the committee and this came up with everybody we spoke to - apprentices having to pay loads of money for tools and so on and not even getting the minimum wage. At the very least, let us give apprentices the minimum wage.
As I said to Deputy Eoghan Kenny a few moments ago, craft and construction apprenticeships are central to delivering vital infrastructure, including housing, and sustaining economic growth. As Minister, I have prioritised annual investment in apprenticeship delivery, which has more than doubled since my Department was established, going from €184 million in 2020 to over €415 million in 2026. Our apprenticeship system has, accordingly, continued to grow. Overall registrations increased by 78%, from just under 5,500 five years ago to just under 10,000 today, with craft registrations in particular rising significantly in that period.
We have a programme for Government target of 12,500 new registrations by 2030, with two thirds in craft and construction-related areas. I have recently secured Cabinet approval for a new action plan for apprenticeships to support further growth in the apprenticeship sector, attract more young people into careers through apprenticeships, and pivot more people towards the apprenticeship route as an equal alternative to the CAO path and the traditional higher educational route, one that can lead to a very satisfying, rewarding career in many ways.
On the Deputy's particular point about the wage of an apprentice, I take the point on board that is often raised. It is significantly more than any student will receive, which is zero. A student does not get paid at all and an apprentice does get paid as they progress through. It is not unique among occupations to receive no or little funding by way of payment during training. When I trained as a barrister - as a devil - we were not paid either. It is not unique to apprentices. There are many professions where this happens to people who go in at the early stages.
Typically, it begins to surpass the minimum wage after second year. By the time someone is out working in the economy post qualification, the median wage is about €915 within two years of qualification, which compares very favourably with alternative pathways that other students and young people might follow. I would again stress to anyone thinking about it that it is a very attractive and rewarding career option for many to go into.
That is a bit of a hard case to make to young people who are looking at their options and see that they will be getting paid €7.67 an hour in the first year, or just over half the national minimum wage. I am in favour of an increased student grant and so on, but the difference is that these people are working. They are creating value for their employers. It is a real obstacle. According to Mr. Ben Friel, who was at the Joint Committee on Further and Higher Education, Research, Innovation and Science when I was a member, many apprentices dropped out in the first year because they could not afford the tools and were expected to pay big upfront costs. The low pay, along with the fees and the price of tools, was creating many barriers to entry.
We introduced a Bill to scrap the exemption for apprentices to ensure that everyone would get the minimum wage. I was contacted by multiple apprentices saying their situations were not doable and they could not exist. These are often people with kids - we heard statistics on that. Many of them are in their 20s or older. They are not young people. This is not a bit of pocket money. They deserve to get the minimum wage at the very least.
I think that is fair. We are trying through Government policy to encourage people at different life stages to enter the apprenticeship journey. I agree that it is not just young people coming out of school and going into apprenticeships any more. There are people crossing over. I met a number of apprentices, including people mid-career and at mid-life stages, some of whom had families and other commitments, so I get that. It is true, though, that if you take the usual alternative scenario of a full-time higher education course, you could have a flat with four people sharing together - two apprentices and two students - and the apprentices will be getting €7 or €8 an hour while the students will not be getting anything per hour. If we look at the alternative pathways, apprentices are being paid something as they go through and that increases in line with their training. There is a balance as well, because the employer has to be incentivised to take on the apprentice. For any trainee, they are probably costing more at the start than they are giving back in terms of useful output, given that it takes a while for them to become productive in their workforce.
We engage with the trade unions all the time and have a framework in place where the trade unions sit down and set rates in partnership with the employers and the educational framework. That is the model we have followed to date.
An apprentice - a first-year motor mechanic - contacted me after we introduced the Bill. He said:
I am currently working a 40-hour week at €6.20 an hour. I am expected to pay for my own tools. To be fair, the employer I am with gives a tool allowance of €250 but that would barely get you much. To even get into an apprenticeship in Ireland it is a minimum requirement across most trades you must be able to drive and hold a licence. As a first year, I am expected to pay the extortionate prices of insurance on top of loan repayments for the car.
Even if we forget that point for a minute - I rarely forget the issue of workers' rights and people getting less than the minimum wage - if we are serious about addressing the housing crisis and getting people into apprenticeships, then this is an immediate measure that could be taken and would have a significant impact in terms of people coming into the trades. The committee on higher education produced a report in February that recommended that a minimum wage floor be introduced, which was obviously informed by all of those apprentices who were saying this was a big issue for them.
There is a framework in place where the trade unions and employers engage together on setting rates. The relevant legislation falls under the Department of Enterprise, Tourism and Employment as opposed to my own Department. The minimum wage laws are part of the Industrial Training Act 1967 and the Labour Services Act 1987. All apprentices are, of course, employees. During the on-the-job phase of an apprenticeship, they are paid a wage by their employer. Neither SOLAS nor my Department is responsible for setting the rate of pay.
In the case of craft apprenticeships, minimum rates of pay are typically determined through that collective bargaining arrangement, subject to the normal dispute resolution mechanisms and are often underpinned by sectoral employment orders. We have well-established mechanisms engaging in partnership with the representative bodies to set these rates. That is the practice that has been there for some time. Perhaps there is a conversation that has to happen across the partners in that system. Certainly, it is beyond the remit of my Department exclusively or even at all in some cases. I hear the point the Deputy raises, and it is fair one. It is a balancing act. All the parties are at the table already setting those rates and agreeing sectoral employment orders.
88. Deputy Eoghan Kenny asked the Minister for Further and Higher Education, Research, Innovation and Science given the growth in apprenticeships in Ireland if he is considering plans to introduce a CAO-type application process to secure an apprenticeship; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [50207/26]
As I have mentioned already during these questions, given the growth in apprenticeships in Ireland, is the Department considering plans to introduce a CAO style type of application process to secure an apprenticeship? We all know there is a significant number of people who are waiting and trying to get an apprenticeship and trying to get a company to take them on for their apprenticeship. There is the CAO system and an application process for students who are going into further and higher education from sixth year. Is that going to be brought in for apprenticeships?
I thank the Deputy. The CAO processes applications for undergraduate courses in higher education. Unlike higher education, apprenticeships are different. They are employment-led programmes that start in the workplace. The apprentices are employed, registered with SOLAS and training is a combination of on-the-job work experience and structured off-the-job training. Part of the process of starting an apprenticeship is finding an employer and arranging with that employer to take the apprentice on. It is a little bit more direct and deliberative than the CAO process where a student applies to a course and sees what availability there is. In the case of an apprenticeship, they start by going through an employer, come to an arrangement locally and then they commence their training. It is the other way around. For that reason, apprenticeships are not historically advertised on the CAO rather employers advertise apprenticeship vacancies directly. They can do that in many ways. They can use - and I encourage them to do so - the Generation Apprenticeship website and apprenticeship.ie. If the Deputy goes onto its website, as he probably has done, and I have done as well, he can look through it. I looked through my own county out of interest to see what was available. I was surprised to find that many were not available. When I looked into it further, I found they were being provided but the employers had not signed up to the apprenticeship.ie website. The response I got was that they did not need to because they are getting apprentices coming to them anyway. There is a gap there. I encourage more employers to utilise the available machinery and frameworks we have put in place to allow that kind of matching take place between the apprentice and apprentice employer.
Of course, my priority is to ensure learners can access clear information on all pathways and tertiary pathways. A new apprenticeship action plan will be published later this year. A big focus of that is improving the communication and access to opportunities. People cannot apply for something if they do not know it exists or know where to start. One of things we have done is that we have included apprenticeship information on the CAO website. It is not quite a CAO process but it is on the CAO website. Ultimately, I would like to get to a point where we have a one-stop-shop students, apprentices, learners and all young people can come into and begin their journey.
In relation to apprenticeship.ie, I ask the Department to promote this more strongly and more to career guidance teachers in our secondary schools who are probably aware of it but I am not necessarily sure how many parents or young people are aware of apprenticeship.ie. It is a simple fix. It probably would not need a lot of funding to promote that. The main focus of the question is on the fact they are no longer confined to the traditional trades anymore where they approach a local plumber or carpenter to take an apprentice on. It is covering areas like ICT, finance, biopharma, logistics and engineering. They are providing young people and career changers with excellent opportunities to earn while they learn. It is an opportunity so employers have more of an understanding of how to get the apprenticeships but also apprentices would be able to access local employers or national employers.
The Deputy is right. We need to continue to promote this pathway. My Department is very industrious and engaged on that front. Among a number of things, we launched the careers in construction action plan and relaunched it recently with a number of actions. There are over 20 actions related to the promotion of training opportunities and activities to make students and would be apprentices aware and to encourage greater gender balance across the apprenticeship sector, particularly craft apprenticeships. On International Women's Day, I attended an event with my colleague, Deputy Dempsey, in Trim, attended by students from all-female secondary schools and at which we highlighted the ability of that as a path. At a time when we have great construction challenges and ambitions, we cannot afford to leave one half of the workforce outside of that conservation. That was strongly welcomed. We have the building heroes campaign which is running at the moment. It has 12 young people sharing their stories about working in construction. Among them, there are four outstanding female young apprentices who are sharing their stories. That is a strong tool to attract people into the pathways as well.
I am willing to work with the Minister on this. Our objective should be to remove barriers and not create them. If Ireland is to meet its future skills need, we must make apprenticeships as visible, accessible and attractive as every other education pathway. I welcome the Minister's views. This CAO style application system for apprenticeships is not going to happen overnight but that is the ambition the Department should have. It is the ambition we should have in this House as policymakers and public representatives. There is an opportunity to give every young person across the country, no matter what pathway they want to go down, the best possible opportunity to access that pathway. That includes a centralised application system like the one we have for those who are heading into undergraduate programmes to provide them, as the Minister said, with a one-stop-shop. That is the level of engagement we must have with those young people who are seeking apprenticeships but also with career guidance teachers, employers who are willing to take on apprenticeships and the higher institutions.
I wish to take the opportunity to thank the higher and further education committee for its work on the report on apprenticeships, which I received in February, led by Deputy McGreehan and supported by Deputy Kenny and others in the House. There are 48 actions in that which will be considered. I will action as many of them as I can in the next round of the action plan. We are engaging in second level schools. There is a documentary on careers that has been circulated. The National Apprenticeship Office has done some very good work around the promotion of apprenticeships and options and trying to remove any barriers that may exist and raise awareness. The Deputy is also correct that second level is the key point. That is where people make choices about their future career paths. Engagement with career guidance counsellors and secondary schools more broadly is something we certainly look at more. I will work with the Minister, Deputy Naughton, in the second level system around pathways there and look to promote that. We will continue to try to centralise information to have a one-stop-shop, whether a person is going down a university path, apprenticeship path or tertiary path, to ensure we have a place we can point people to and where all the information is freely available.
89. Deputy Tony McCormack asked the Minister for Further and Higher Education, Research, Innovation and Science the progress being made in expanding lifelong learning opportunities to support people in upskilling and reskilling throughout their working lives; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [50028/26]
We are all very aware of what is happening in the AI space and the rapid pace it is taking over our lives, both at home and in businesses. What progress is being made in expanding lifelong learning opportunities to support people in upskilling and reskilling throughout their working lives? I am specifically referencing AI and the business requirements and businesses needs companies have at the moment.
I thank the Deputy very much for raising this important issue. Just this morning before I came into the House, I attended an event in the Accenture offices in Dublin, sponsored by IBEC, where it had a conversation on AI and future skills needs. It was a wide-ranging conversation. It has published a report. It is publicly available. I was attending the launch of that report but there was also a panel discussion on the impact of AI on the workforce and on employers and employees. There was a general finding that while many SMEs are aware of the challenges and opportunities it provides, they may not necessarily have confidence that they have the capacity to take it on at the moment. That is something I am determined to address.
The expansion of lifelong learning opportunities is a central priority for me and the Department. Most people accept and agree it is not just about the one point in life education, when a person comes out of school or college, but it is about ongoing lifelong learning, as the Deputy rightly raised in his question. We are making significant and sustained investment across a number of initiatives to make sure workers, jobseekers and employers have access to flexible high-quality learning opportunities. Skillnet Ireland plays a big part in that in terms of enterprise-led upskilling. Springboard+ and MicroCreds are two programmes I have for learning in the workforce and learning while one earns. The skills to advance programme provides further as well. I recently committed another €4 million to short MicroCreds courses employees can take while in work.
They control those now so there are subsidised voucher schemes for short-cycle courses that are provided through the Springboard+ programme.
We then have the new aiready.ie website, which I launched about six weeks ago. As of this morning, 7,500 users had signed up to that and were using it on a regular basis. The intention of that platform is to continue to drive that on, to add content and to add to it. It started off as an entry-level demystifying exercise to take away the fear of AI and promote it, but the intention is that the website will continue to grow to become a more advanced user portal, including gateways to other courses, such as the likes the ETBs are offering, in that space as well.
I commend the Minister and his Department on the priority they have placed on lifelong learning. It is something we should be very proud of. We now have the highest level of third level education attainment in the European Union, with over 65% of young adults holding a third level qualification. We are also performing strongly in the lifelong learning ranking, at sixth in the European Union for adult participation. However, while sixth is a strong position, we should always aim to be number one. As technology evolves and careers become more dynamic, lifelong learning is no longer simply an education issue; it is becoming an economic necessity. When I say that, I am talking about the business requirements and the jobs that will be lost. We have to be very cognisant of the opportunities that are there with AI but also be willing to make sure we achieve and keep the jobs we have already in the economy.
We will see a period of change and of flux. There are challenges but there are also opportunities. Some jobs may well be lost but other jobs will be created, including different types of jobs. An example was given during the conversation this morning that when the Excel spreadsheet came into widespread use about 25 years ago, there were predictions there would be no more accountants and that they would become obsolete as a profession. In fact, there are probably more of them and more accounting firms than ever. What accountants have done is move up the value chain in terms of offering strategic financial advice as opposed to being calculators. My own view is that as technology continues to evolve, we as a training system and State must remain ahead of and on top to it and embrace it in some cases.
One initiative I recently launched which may be of interest to the Deputy is the national skills round tables. I am bringing together employers, employees and the training agencies in different sectors to ask what they need from the training agency, how technological change impacts them and how other developments and demographics impact them. We had a construction skills round table in UCD recently. I had a technological round table event last week at the Vodafone office. Later this month, I will bring together professional services including accounting, legal and consultancy-type firms to ask what changes they are seeing in their workforce and how the training system education systems can respond to that proactively.
One of Ireland's greatest competitive advantages has always been the quality of the people. Increasingly, however, international investors are looking at not only educational attainment but how quickly a country's workforce can adapt to technological changes and acquire new skills. With AI, as we talked about earlier, transforming almost every sector of our economy, lifelong learning is becoming an increasingly important factor in attracting and retaining foreign direct investment. Countries that can rapidly upskill and reskill their workforce will have a significant competitive advantage and I strongly support the work the Minister is doing in this area. Will he outline how his Department is working with employers, higher education institutions and enterprise agencies to strengthen Ireland's culture of lifelong learning and ensure we will remain one of the most attractive locations in Europe for investment now and in the years ahead?
A bit of shorthand I often use, and I know a number of State agencies also use, to talk about the pace of change is the four Ds - digitalisation, decarbonisation, demographics and deglobalisation. All four of these things are happening quickly and we are living in a fast-changing world. The Deputy is right that we need to be adaptable and flexible. Some of the ways in which we are responding to that include, as I mentioned, the skills round tables in which I am engaging, where each month I do a different sectoral dive with employers and training agencies around the table to understand their needs.
We also have the national skills council, which was created last year and is headed up by Dr. Kevin Marshall. A number of my officials are involved in it. It looks at the skills needs that are emerging. We have a skills observatory, which is effectively a database that provides real-time information about skills gaps, skills needs and what types of vacancies there are. There are some new occupations coming into being and some occupations that perhaps are no longer as much in demand. To get ahead of that, we need to ask if we have the people, and in many cases it is the same people, who can be skilled up for those.
I mentioned the AI ready programme. We are also exploring a number of national skills academies, which are sector-specific partnerships between colleges, employers and industries to make sure we can provide the type of training in real time that they and their industries need.
90. Deputy Grace Boland asked the Minister for Further and Higher Education, Research, Innovation and Science the number of training and education places available across further and higher education, apprenticeships and upskilling programmes aimed at developing the workforce required to deliver energy-efficient homes, including retrofitting, construction and related trades; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [50102/26]
117. Deputy Grace Boland asked the Minister for Further and Higher Education, Research, Innovation and Science the measures being taken or planned by his Department to increase the number of training places and pathways for individuals to gain the skills necessary to deliver energy-efficient homes, including in areas such as retrofitting, heat pump installation and sustainable construction; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [50101/26]
We know we have environmental targets. We know we want families to live in warm, fully insulated homes. That has never been more important, when we look at the geopolitical climate we are living in. However, there are real concerns as to whether we have the workforce to deliver warm, insulated homes - both new builds and retrofittings. How many do we currently have in training in the industry? What steps is the Minister taking to increase that to make sure that we not only meet our climate targets but help families to live in warm, insulated homes?
I propose to take Questions Nos. 90 and 117 together.
The Deputy is absolutely right that this is a really important area of focus. I mentioned earlier the broader need for construction skills across every sector to meet the ambitions the Government has set out in terms of infrastructure delivery, be that transport, the metro project or DART+ - I know the Deputy’s constituency is in line for some benefits from the public transport programmes - the housing needs we have, which are central to the Government's ambition, and the retrofit and green energy revolution that is at our fingertips. In the energy space, that includes a commitment of €10 billion to enhance the grid capacity, because we need to be able to transit the energy as well as generate it, the workforce and the talent to do that - everything from retrofitting to green energy technicians and renewable energy engineers.
I was in Munster Technological University, MTU, in Tralee recently and visited the centre where offshore wind turbine mechanics are being trained up on a new course there. We also have a centre for maritime skills in National Maritime College of Ireland, NMCI, in Cork. Right around the country we see similar types of courses being created. We also have the nearly zero energy building, NZEB, and retrofitting specialty. We have a couple of NZEB centres of excellence operated by Tipperary ETB, Kildare and Wicklow ETB and Cavan and Monaghan ETB. These are creating centres of excellence for these NZEBs and the idea is that they can then have specialist training provided in areas like plumbing, electrical, heat pump installation, site supervision, renewable energy installations and so on. In some cases we have courses available for people who are already in construction or already have a qualification or familiarity in order to allow them to reskill very quickly, sometimes as quickly as three or four days. In other courses we have full apprenticeships and full programmes over a number of years to deliver those.
More broadly, and this is something I think there is great potential to do more on, we are also promoting modern methods of construction, MMC, so we can embrace 2D or 3D models where they are either partially assembled off site and then brought to the location or almost fully assembled and the finished kit is brought into place. If we can fully embrace MMC, we will have a potential 40% dividend in productivity, which means we can do more with less. That will enable us to more quickly and efficiently meet many of our needs in that area. There is a great opportunity there. Mount Lucas in County Offaly is a demonstration site I have visited a number of times with Deputy McCormack and others. That is a really good example but we have others. Wexford County Council had a project under way as well and 12 homes are being built out using MMC.
There are a number of ways we can do this. We are also implementing an action plan, which I launched last year, that contains 58 actions coming from the expert group on future skills needs. They are looking at the wide-scale adoption of MMC and how we can enhance this more and provide more training and more skills to ultimately deliver on the ambitions we all share.
It is good to hear that work is under way. What I did not hear is whether we know the numbers we need to get to. As the Minister said, a broad range of skill sets are required to deliver these homes. Is there co-ordination between the Minister's Department and the Department of Climate, Energy and the Environment? We know the targets we want to get to for 2030. Do we know the numbers of skilled workers we will need across the broad range to get there? Is the Department supporting that to ensure that there are sufficient programmes to deliver the numbers of skilled workers?
I just did not hear that in the answer. It is really important that we have co-ordination. The Department of Climate, Energy and the Environment has substantial money, which should be used to support having a skilled workforce in place.
If there is substantial money there, the Deputy can point me to it because it is all accounted for in my budget. It would be great if I did have more money but that will be something for the Estimates process when we go through that.
In terms of the numbers that are required, a recent independent report I commissioned from Indecon, which I brought to Cabinet, looked at our future construction workforce needs. It found that we have a shortage of skilled workers projected over the next ten years if we play out all of our national missions such as the infrastructure and public transport projects, the grid renewal and meeting the housing demand. My Department and the agencies will absolutely ramp up output to the maximum possible while preserving quality in the systems, and will examine a number of ways that we might be able to do that, one of which is by using modern methods of construction but there may be other methods we can utilise as well. Ultimately, as a society we have to examine whether there will be an enduring gap. Skills migration is going to be part of that solution. Value-added migration is something we will have to be alive to, particularly when workforce needs cannot be met domestically alone. There are other areas we have to look at to help fill those gaps but first and foremost the priority would be producing the skills, the talent and the educated workers through our training agencies, universities and apprenticeship systems. As has been mentioned, we will have to reskill many workers. There are many people with particular skills who are already in working in construction and who, with a light enhancement to their qualifications such as the three- or four-day courses that are already available in places like Mount Lucas and elsewhere, can actually skill up and get to the stage where they are proficient in emerging technologies and moving with it.
As I said in response to an earlier question, change continues to come at us. We need to embrace and anticipate change and move ahead of it. That is exactly what we are doing in this area with the likes of those green energy courses, renewables and the wind turbine maintenance course that is provided now in Tralee, and many others, which are fundamental to fulfilling that training need.
I thank the Minister. This is a point I made to the Secretary General of the Department of Climate, Energy and the Environment at the public accounts committee. There is money there and we absolutely need to invest in ensuring that we have retrofitting, and do everything we can to meet our climate targets, not just because of the financial consequences that might arise but because it is the right thing to do. We want people and families to be living in warm and fully insulated buildings. I would like to see the Minister's Department co-ordinate with the Department of Climate, Energy and the Environment, and with his colleague the Minister, Deputy Darragh O'Brien, to make sure we are doing everything we can to make sure we have the skilled workforce to meet our climate targets and deliver for families.
The Minister, Deputy Lawless, has alluded to the awareness at second level of the importance of these various apprenticeship programmes and trades. We really need to be doing everything we can to encourage people into the sector. I would like to see the Minister continue to do his work in that space.
I can absolutely assure the Deputy that I am doing all I can in that space. We have a number of courses in plumbing, electrical, heat pump installation, site supervision, offshore wind turbine maintenance and many others. There is also the adoption more widely of MMC.
Specialist and technical skills are very important but other skills are equally important. The plans we have adopted to date aim to promote skills transferability and include transversal skills. This is something that has emerged from the skills round tables I have been holding with sectors, including the construction sector, very recently. It is coming through from all sectors that while it is desirable to have a technical ability in particular areas, it is even more desirable to have the ability to have portable or flexible skills, leadership or communication skills, teamwork abilities and many skills that transcend one discipline and are multidisciplinary. We have a wider project to ensure that all those kinds of competencies are instilled in all courses, regardless of the discipline undertaken. At the heart of this, and at the heart of the Deputy's question on the courses under the green skills agenda, is making sure that the workforce is equipped to deliver the retrofit programmes and the next generation of energy efficient homes, and of course to take the full opportunity that renewable energy presents to us here in Ireland.
98. Deputy Eoghan Kenny asked the Minister for Further and Higher Education, Research, Innovation and Science for an update on his discussions with the European Research Council in relation to the multi-annual funding framework for science; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [50208/26]
Will the Minister give an update on his discussions with the European Research Council, ERC, in relation to the multi-annual funding framework for science? Ireland has built an international reputation for excellence in scientific research. Our universities and research institutions consistently compete successfully for European funding and Irish researchers have made significant contributions in areas ranging from health and pharmaceuticals to climate science, artificial intelligence and advanced manufacturing.
I thank the Deputy for his interest in this area. It is a critical area. The Deputy asked about the ERC and I think he may also want me to talk about the Horizon Europe programme.
Yes.
They are two separate but complementary activities so I will speak to both in my answer. The European Research Council is one of the key instruments in the EU research and innovation framework programme, Horizon Europe. It was established in 2007 and is the premier European funding organisation for excellent frontier research, funding researchers of any nationality and age. Ahead of the Irish Presidency, just last week, on my invitation the ERC's scientific council came to Dublin. They are an independent group of top researchers who guide the ERC programme. They visited Dublin to hold their plenary meeting and stakeholder engagements. I addressed the council and spoke on the re-election of the president of the European Research Council. I emphasised the importance of supporting bottom-up and curiosity-driven fundamental research, and excellence in research. The Taoiseach also attended and spoke at the same event, which I hope speaks to the high-level Government commitment to supporting this area of excellence and research across all disciplines.
The Horizon Europe programme funds the European Research Council and is the EU's key funding programme for research and innovation. The current programme runs until 2027. In July of last year, the Commission published its proposal for the next Horizon Europe programme as part of the EU budget package for the period 2028 to 2034. Following intensive negotiations the Council, made up of the 27 member states including us, agreed its position on the next Horizon Europe programme just last week in the last week of the Cypriot Presidency. That is a very significant milestone and I congratulate our colleagues in Cyprus on leading out in that agreement. It now falls to me to chair the European Research Council over the next six months during our Presidency. We will now enter what are called trilogue negotiations. Having got the agreement in the Cypriot Presidency, the Irish Presidency will now engage with the Parliament to bring that forward. Chairing it is an honest broker role, so it would not be appropriate for me to get into Ireland's specific interests, although obviously we have made those known in the past. We will now move to chair the debate in an honest broker fashion.
I thank the Minister. The EU Presidency obviously gives us a greater opportunity to work with our European counterparts and, as the Minister is the honest broker chairing that, it is essential that we gain significant experience from the amount that we can invest in scientific research.
It would probably be remiss of me not to mention University College Cork in my county, which does a significant amount of scientific research. I am very proud as a Cork man that we do such fantastic scientific research.
One of the biggest issues raised repeatedly by researchers is the need for greater certainty around long-term funding. Scientific research cannot be planned on a year-to-year basis. Major projects often take many years to develop, requiring sustained investment, international collaboration, and the ability to recruit and retain highly skilled researchers. This is not simply about supporting academia. Research and innovation underpin Ireland's future economic success. It is good that the Minister referenced the Horizon Europe programme.
I could not agree more. It is something that I have put front and centre in my Ministry since I took up this office. Fundamental research is absolutely key to driving Ireland as a knowledge economy, as a society and civilisationally more broadly. It is the key to future knowledge creation, economic growth and societal resilience. It is why I created, for example, the INSPIRE research infrastructure programme, with a €750 million commitment over the term of the Government to roll out research, equipment and facilities right across every higher education authority in Ireland.
In terms of Horizon Europe and Ireland's Presidency, the Deputy rightly said that it is not just about academics. Of course, they are fundamental to it but it is also about wider society and the wider economy. I have adopted an Horizon Europe action plan for the remaining two years of the current programme. From an Irish perspective, one thing we are seeking to do is ensure that SMEs take full opportunity of the participations available to them to draw down. We have drawn down €1 billion in funding from that programme to date just in the current term but there are opportunities to draw down a couple of hundred million more within the current programme even before we get to the new one.
An action plan in respect of Horizon has been published. We partnered with Enterprise Ireland on that. I encourage SMEs that are not already involved to get involved now and make sure they draw down whatever is available for their research activities.
On the broader aspect to this, we invest significantly in educating talented scientists. We must ensure that, having provided funding to educate these talented scientists, we do not put them in the position where they feel they must leave Ireland because they cannot see a stable research career here. I do not have statistics on that but if we are going to engage with and fund young people to become fantastic scientists, we must ensure we provide the funding to make sure they can have a stable research career here, if they wish to have one and if it is possible. Has the Department examined ways to complement the European funding model that we have alongside more predictable national investment? I do not expect him to go into that in detail. There is a budgetary process involved there. There has been significant investment in scientific research but we have to ensure that we match European funding with national investment across the country.
As well as matching European funding, we have surpassed it because while we drew down €1 billion in Horizon Europe funding in the current term, I have committed over €2.45 billion for research funding from State funds, so we are doing far more.
I mentioned the INSPIRE research infrastructure programme, which is a €750 million commitment to research infrastructure. I launched seven new Rinn centres, which are the Research Ireland centres, just last week. That was a €460 million investment, and those centres include things like advanced computing technology, artificial intelligence, quantum computing and big data AI. They also include things like semiconductors, biotechnology, material sciences and health informatics. There are programmes there across societal resilience and economic growth as well as the creation and pursuit of knowledge, which are fundamental goals. Those are the seven latest centres and they complement the existing centres. Overall, over 50% of the Department's national development plan, NDP, allocation has been allocated to supporting research and innovation.
Before we move to the next question, I welcome the service users from St. Aidan's Services in Gorey and in particular Nicole, Ian, Donnchadh and Caroline, who are here with Deputy Brian Brennan. They are all very welcome.
106. Deputy John McGuinness asked the Minister for Further and Higher Education, Research, Innovation and Science if he will engage with SETU to deliver on the commitment in the original agreement establishing a university in the south east to include a significant campus in Kilkenny city; and his views on establishing a Norman study centre as part of the campus.- [50200/26]
During the early negotiations to establish a university in the south east, Kilkenny played a key role. I was associated with those negotiations, many years after which South East Technological University, SETU, was established. What steps are being taken to expand the courses offered in Kilkenny city relative to the university? Does the Minister consider a Norman museum as something appropriate that could be championed and provided?
Before I respond, I wish St. Aidan's Services in Gorey well. I know the organisation very well because Gorey was my hometown before I ever lived in Kildare. My sister-in-law, Laura Walsh, is a service user in St. Aidan's. I do not think she is in the group today but if she is, I say "hello" to her and all of the other service users. The staff do a great job, and I thank them for everything they do. I am very familiar with the organisation's work.
I thank Deputy McGuinness for the question on the campus in Kilkenny city. He raised this directly with me before and I appreciate that. It is something he has championed, and I see the merit in the Norman concept, particularly as we are coming to The Year of the Normans later in this term. That is something that would be appropriate for the commemoration of that period. Kilkenny as a city with its great tradition would be a very suitable home for it.
In terms of how we organise capital projects and support them from within the Department, my Department works with the higher education institutions and education training boards, ETBs, to develop capital projects, along with their master plans. Capital investment is then allocated through a competitive process. Successful projects progress through different stages of planning, tender and construction but ultimately it is a bottom-up process. The institutions come to me with projects as opposed to me going to them to tell them what to do.
The NDP published last July includes the capital ceilings for the next four years, and that is complemented by the tertiary sector's capital investment plan. The capital funding envelop available to me is the mechanism through which I fund these projects, which is significant with €4.55 billion allocated across my Department for capital projects.
SETU is the relevant institute in the south east, and it has multiple campuses, including a presence in the Xcelerate Centre at St. Kieran's College on College Road in Kilkenny. It has an action to enhance key strategic partnerships, as well as the establishment of a working group with Kilkenny County Council and Kilkenny Chamber of Commerce to explore opportunities for further development in Kilkenny. I am sure the Deputy is probably involved in that already but that seems to be an appropriate grouping to maybe advance this project through because if it was to put together a proposal or master plan, it could come up the chain to me thereafter.
The reason that I raise it directly with the Minister this morning is that in those early negotiations, it was clearly stated that Kilkenny would have a significant role in the context of the south-east university, now SETU. I want to see that delivered on because Kilkenny was part of the agreement to establish the headquarters and so in Waterford and the other various activities under SETU. I want to see the commitment that was made to Kilkenny as part of that south-east university honoured. I suggest to the Minister that in honouring the commitment, SETU should be encouraged to discuss the possibility of a Norman study centre.
Kilkenny is associated with animation, thanks to Cartoon Saloon and so on. There is also Kilkenny Design. I am sure there are many other activities and courses that could be arranged in Kilkenny. I am trying to develop the idea and while I understand that the funding request must go from SETU to the Minister, I hope that by reminding the Minister of the commitment that was given, he might encourage discussions to advance what I suggested.
I certainly will, and I am open to proposals coming in from SETU on that. In fact, more than that, the next time I meet with SETU, I will inquire about the status of this proposal and what its intentions are regarding it.
Regarding SETU investment in the region more broadly, one of the most significant enhancements planned for Kilkenny is the development of Kildalton Agricultural College. It will accommodate the new veterinary programme roll-out, which will have 40 student vets attending in the south east for the first time. This will complement the 40 students that will attend the Atlantic Technological University, ATU, in the north west. That is a really exciting programme that specifically includes anatomy and pathology training facilities at Kildalton for the practical side of the training. That will go live this September with 40 new students signed up for that.
As the Deputy suggested, I see the merit in the Norman study centre, and I will raise it when I next meet with SETU. However, in the first instance, it falls on it to come forward with the proposal.
The Deputy was with me when I visited Kilkenny recently to launch the college of the future project. That is moving ahead, and I encourage it to get ready to appoint the design teams. I expect that project to progress rapidly in the near future.
I welcome the development in relation to the ETB and acknowledge the significant contribution it is making in terms of apprenticeships and so on. Regarding the veterinary college at Kildalton, those 40 vets will certainly make a difference. I also believe that Kildalton college can be developed at a rapid pace to bring the numbers up in terms of veterinary students, and it is an excellent site beyond the veterinary designation that it now has.
I come back to the point that it was the goodwill of all concerned many years ago that brought about the establishment of SETU, and the different political players there were given certain commitments and that is why I am pressing the Minister. I know there is investment taking place and that there are different activities, courses and so on but I am simply anxious, as the Minister will appreciate, to ensure that it continues to grow and expand.
I share that ambition. It is important that it has a footprint across the south-east region.
To be fair, we met with Kildalton. We are seeing this at other locations across the south east. I take the point about that particular project, which the Deputy would like to see being advanced more rapidly. That is a fair ask. Kilkenny is a growing city with really strong employment. I worked there with VHI for a number of years, so I am familiar with the potential that the city has in the wider region and how it is already a hub for really strong employers, both domestic and international. There is FDI going into Kilkenny at Purcellsinch business park and other places. That can only continue. The veterinary college that the ETBs are putting in place and that I am supporting will be helpful to that ambition also. I understand that further investment of the type the Deputy proposes will be welcome also. I am certainly happy to take it up with SETU, and I am sure the Deputy will also do so through his own offices.
95. Deputy Brendan Smith asked the Minister for Further and Higher Education, Research, Innovation and Science the additional measures that will be implemented to intensify collaboration and delivery of further and higher education on a cross-border and all-Ireland basis; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [50256/26]
The Minister will have heard me many times in this House, at committees and at meetings of the Fianna Fáil parliamentary party advocating for closer collaboration on the delivery of education on an all-Ireland basis. There is fantastic potential, especially in the further and higher education sector. I warmly welcome the Minister’s initiative, along with Dundalk Institute of Technology, DkIT, and Queen’s University, to develop a new partnership that will enable DKIT to become a university college of Queen’s. That is a great all-Ireland development. It is a landmark decision and is of particular value for the entire north-east region and much farther afield.
I thank Deputy Smith for his constant engagement in respect of this matter. I know it is one that is very dear to him. Through his chairmanship of the British-Irish Parliamentary Assembly, he is advancing ties between our jurisdictions all the time and looking to extend cross-border and all-Ireland relationships. I very much share his ambition in that regard.
My Department is engaged in extensive collaboration with the Northern Ireland Executive and the relevant agencies to enhance further and higher education across the island of Ireland. In April, I secured approval from the Cabinet to enable DkIT to join with Queen’s University to enter into a new strategic partnership, the first ever all-Ireland university. It is a really exciting project. We are advancing the legislation, and the drafting is currently under way. I thank the committee for its work on the pre-legislative scrutiny and for engaging with it so proactively. It is a landmark initiative that is fundamental to our shared, all-island missions. It will also enhance research and innovation in the north-east and along the Dublin-Belfast corridor, and provide new opportunities for students and employers.
More broadly, my Department continues to work with the Department of Health to expand cross-border healthcare training, including an agreement with Queen’s Belfast to support 50 Irish-funded undergraduate medical places across the intakes of the last two years. Of course, we have the Creating Futures document, which is the new further education and training strategy that was published a month ago. It looks to strengthen all-island collaboration and foster joint initiatives between ETBs and FET schools here and their equivalents across Northern Ireland.
I worked recently with Caoimhe Archibald, the Northern Ireland Minister for the Economy, to launch the first-ever all-island apprenticeship in the area of accounting technician. We met as part of the Government summit at Farmleigh. We launched that initiative having worked together on it for several months beforehand. We have a number of other initiatives that we are looking at that are along the same lines. Both Departments have secured €50 million through PEACEPLUS for skills development, which we will continue to roll out. We also have five new online projects being delivered, and there is much more that we can do on this.
I thank the Minister for his reply. I must say that members of the British-Irish Parliamentary Assembly, across all jurisdictions, were very strong in their praise of the Minister’s contribution at our plenary meeting in Surrey, where he spoke about the opportunities for all-Ireland developments and also east-west developments.
At a recent meeting of the further and higher education committee, we had the leadership of Queen’s University and the leadership of DkIT. They are very anxious to drive this partnership forward in a positive manner. They very much appreciate the leadership the Minister has shown. One of the great messages that came out of that meeting was the willingness of both Queen’s and Dundalk to work with the other education colleges. They already have a partnership with colleges whereby people can commence a course in a college of further education and then complete their degree course in either Dundalk or Queen’s. They are anxious to intensify that collaboration between the higher education institutes and the further education colleges across Cavan and Monaghan, and in our neighbouring counties north of the Border.
One project that I did not mention in my initial response is the digital creative industries programme, which is a €10 million, all-island project supported by shared island capital. It will enhance collaboration with the creative and digital industries in areas like graphic design, movies, the arts and digital arts across both jurisdictions. It is a project that is now live. It was one of the shared island projects in my Department.
Regarding the ETBs and the options for further education and training to work on a cross-border basis, my Department is working with SOLAS to develop a detailed implementation plan for the new Creating Futures FET strategy. One of those actions is to advance all-island collaboration through specific all-island linkages and partnerships to engage with education, training, enterprise and industry stakeholders in Northern Ireland. Of course, we have the Queen’s-DkIT partnership, and there are a number of ancillary projects now coming into being under that, which I look forward to supporting strongly as they come through. In fact, I am inviting proposals for that. I know the Deputy has worked closely with the ETBs in Cavan, Monaghan and elsewhere. If there are projects that he wants to bring to my attention, I would welcome that input.
As the Minister is aware, we are very anxious to progress the Cavan college of the future. I sincerely hope there will be further developments on that over the summer months. We are anxious to have that major new extension to the existing college constructed on Cathedral Road, right in the centre of Cavan town, where there is a demand for new accommodation. The Minister saw first-hand the work that goes on at the institute. It draws students from a wide area. It has a huge success rate for students fulfilling career choices, following the careers chosen before they went into college and going on to attain further higher education qualifications. It is very important that we move that project along as quickly as possible. The accommodation is needed, and the Minister can be assured that the people, the director of the college and his staff will ensure that the students who attend will get the very best options across all courses, and the best in learning and teaching as well.
I thank the Deputy for his invitation to visit that day, along with the Minister of State, Deputy Niamh Smyth. We had a very good engagement in Cavan and then visited the institute. I share the Deputy’s desire to see the college of the future advance at pace. I hope to have a positive announcement on that in the near future. I will certainly be keeping Members apprised of that. It is my intention that the institute would be able to appoint a design team in the coming months, and that we are able to progress with that project, which is much needed. I could see that myself when visiting the site and speaking to learners and educators while traversing the school that is already there. They are doing great work, which will be enhanced by the provision of a capital project for the further training centre, which I hope to be able to support strongly in the coming months. That is a very important project on which I will continue to work.
More broadly, as part of the shared island initiative, there are other projects that fall under the ambit of the Queen’s-DkIT partnership that I intend to support. I also intend to further advance the collaboration on a North-South basis. As I mentioned already, we recently launched the first all-island apprenticeship for accounting technician, and there are a couple of others that are being considered. Where possible, I intend to roll that out and increase the capacity.
107. Deputy Eoghan Kenny asked the Minister for Further and Higher Education, Research, Innovation and Science if he has met with an organisation (details supplied) regarding gaps in higher education funding; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [50206/26]
Has the Minister met with the Irish Universities Association regarding gaps in higher education funding?
The short answer is that I have. I engaged with the Irish Universities Association, IUA, as recently as this morning, when I met Paul Johnston, the director general, at an event. I am very aware of the association's asks. It is something that we are working through with it with regard to future funding. There was a commitment through the national training fund to continue to support the core funding allocation for Irish universities. I sat down with the IUA and we reviewed its pre-budget submission, which has a number of worthwhile asks within it. I am continuing to engage with the IUA on a very regular basis, and also with the Technological Universities Association and other stakeholders within the space. I am very much aware of their asks. We have met their funding requirements for the last couple of years through a new framework emerging from, first, the Cassells report and then the Funding the Future study. That funding is now being committed on a multi-annual basis.
The request from the Irish Universities Association is for €250 million over the next five years in capital spending to upgrade digital infrastructure in the seven universities, and €475 million over four years in capital spending to decarbonise universities and create fully sustainable campuses.
We regularly hear about Ireland's ambition to be a global leader in innovation, research and skills. We want to attract investment, develop indigenous enterprise and prepare our workforce for the industries of the future. None of these ambitions can be achieved if our universities are expected to do more each year with increasingly stretched resources. I ask the Minister to continue engaging with them through the budgetary process.
As I mentioned in response to earlier questions, we have a commitment of €4.55 billion to the sector more broadly in the capital envelope available through the national development plan, which is record investment and strong support for research and innovation in the higher and further education ecosystems.
I have taken receipt of the IUA's pre-budget submission. I have to go through it. I understand the challenges the sector faces in terms of decarbonisation, digitalisation, globalisation and demographics, something we often speak about in the House. I am very much engaged in that. It is one among many pre-budget submissions that I have received. I will assess it with my officials. There are a number of competing demands on the system, as the Deputy will be aware. We will be able to appraise ourselves and other Members of the House on exactly where they fall in October's budget.
I want to focus on students. They rightly expect access to modern facilities, smaller class sizes, adequate academic supports and quality learning environments. These expectations become increasingly difficult to meet when institutions are under a sustained financial strain. Ireland has an international reputation for the quality of its higher education system. Protecting that reputation requires investment. It is far more cost-effective to invest now than to allow standards to decline and attempt to rebuild capacity later.
Exactly. That is why we have a record €4.5 billion commitment across the sector. Regarding student facilities, there is the likes of the bundle 2 PPP programme which enhances student facilities on university campuses across the country. I mentioned the targeted enhancement fund, which supports technological universities in their continued growth. The results are coming through. In the last 100 top university rankings, Irish universities were back in the top 100 having fallen out of the list over the past decade or so. We have seen significant progress in terms of international comparators. More fundamentally, student numbers and outputs are growing and many qualifications are being pursued. There are now many diverse pathways through the tertiary education system, including, of course, apprenticeships, which we discussed earlier. It is a success story and we want to make sure it continues to be so. We will continue to invest in and support the sector.
